Trac problems and hosting

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Trac problems and hosting

Vadim Zeitlin-4
 Hi,

 Does anybody know if poor Trac performance and frequent errors are due to
the software itself or lack of resources on the server which hosts it? I.e.
would it help if it had twice as much memory? Looking at RAM prices
nowadays it looks like it really oughtn't be a problem to find a server
with more memory. I don't offer to host it myself because I don't think I
have enough bandwidth (BTW, Robin, do you have any idea about how much does
it consume?) but it would be really great to give it more resources *if*
this is the cause of the problems with it as using it remains painful right
now in spite of Robin's best efforts.

 Thanks,
VZ

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Re: Trac problems and hosting

Marcin Wojdyr-3
On Mon, May 4, 2009 at 06:11, Vadim Zeitlin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>  Hi,
>
>  Does anybody know if poor Trac performance and frequent errors are due to
> the software itself or lack of resources on the server which hosts it? I.e.

I remember reading somewhere that using postgresql instead of sqlite
(we are using sqlite, right?) prevents "datebase is locked" errors.

Marcin

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Re: Trac problems and hosting

Robin Dunn
In reply to this post by Vadim Zeitlin-4
Vadim Zeitlin wrote:

>  Hi,
>
>  Does anybody know if poor Trac performance and frequent errors are due to
> the software itself or lack of resources on the server which hosts it? I.e.
> would it help if it had twice as much memory? Looking at RAM prices
> nowadays it looks like it really oughtn't be a problem to find a server
> with more memory. I don't offer to host it myself because I don't think I
> have enough bandwidth (BTW, Robin, do you have any idea about how much does
> it consume?) but it would be really great to give it more resources *if*
> this is the cause of the problems with it as using it remains painful right
> now in spite of Robin's best efforts.

I think if we can offload the mail lists then we can add postgresql
without impacting anything else.  I think that will go a long ways to
helping out Trac.  Something else that I would like to find the time to
do is to update the linux distribution.  Currently it's running Ubuntu
6.06 plus some custom built packages, so I expect that getting newer
versions of the critical packages will help stabilize things too.

--
Robin Dunn
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Re[2]: Trac problems and hosting

Vadim Zeitlin-4
On Tue, 05 May 2009 00:34:03 -0700 Robin Dunn <[hidden email]> wrote:

RD> I think if we can offload the mail lists then we can add postgresql
RD> without impacting anything else.  I think that will go a long ways to
RD> helping out Trac.

 I still don't really like the idea that the machine is shut down if the
load is too high, this makes it really difficult to do anything about it
when you're unavailable, I'd rather prefer it to crawl along, even if very
slowly, than to shut down completely. Of course, this means having a
dedicated machine probably but would this really cost so much more?

 After all I don't think we need that much RAM/CPU/other resources. But of
course I don't really know, it would be nice to have some statistics about
the current usage.

 Thanks,
VZ

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Re: Trac problems and hosting

Robin Dunn
In reply to this post by Vadim Zeitlin-4
Vadim Zeitlin wrote:
>  Hi,
>
> I don't offer to host it myself because I don't think I
> have enough bandwidth (BTW, Robin, do you have any idea about how much does
> it consume?)

Trac requires SVN is on the same machine, so if Trac is moved then SVN
would need to be also.  The two reporting tools I have installed report
different usage stats, but the largest reported numbers for April are:

svn.wxwidgets.org: 25.5 G
trac.wxwidgets.org: 9.9 G

February was the highest in the last six months:

svn.wxwidgets.org: 39.5 G
trac.wxwidgets.org: 21.3 G


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Re: Trac problems and hosting

Robin Dunn
In reply to this post by Vadim Zeitlin-4
Vadim Zeitlin wrote:

> On Tue, 05 May 2009 00:34:03 -0700 Robin Dunn <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> RD> I think if we can offload the mail lists then we can add postgresql
> RD> without impacting anything else.  I think that will go a long ways to
> RD> helping out Trac.
>
>  I still don't really like the idea that the machine is shut down if the
> load is too high, this makes it really difficult to do anything about it
> when you're unavailable, I'd rather prefer it to crawl along, even if very
> slowly, than to shut down completely. Of course, this means having a
> dedicated machine probably but would this really cost so much more?

It's been a while since I shopped and compared dedicated server hosting,
but last time I did they started at about $99 per month.  That's about 3
times what I am paying now.

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Re: Trac problems and hosting

Robin Dunn
In reply to this post by Vadim Zeitlin-4
Vadim Zeitlin wrote:
>  Hi,
>
>  Does anybody know if poor Trac performance and frequent errors are due to
> the software itself or lack of resources on the server which hosts it? I.e.
> would it help if it had twice as much memory?

Oh, I should also mention that the VPS currently has 1G dedicated RAM
with 1G burst (essentially same as swap space) and with the current
services running the memory usage is almost always well within that 1G
size.  Before the last upgrade it was dipping into that burst ram often
and so would have essentially been thrashing virtual memory.  (And we
didn't have most of the spike problems until after that upgrade, so the
thrashing may have actually helped keep the load down...)

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Re[2]: Trac problems and hosting

Vadim Zeitlin-4
In reply to this post by Robin Dunn
On Tue, 05 May 2009 10:52:25 -0700 Robin Dunn <[hidden email]> wrote:

RD> Trac requires SVN is on the same machine, so if Trac is moved then SVN
RD> would need to be also.  The two reporting tools I have installed report
RD> different usage stats, but the largest reported numbers for April are:
RD>
RD> svn.wxwidgets.org: 25.5 G
RD> trac.wxwidgets.org: 9.9 G
RD>
RD> February was the highest in the last six months:
RD>
RD> svn.wxwidgets.org: 39.5 G
RD> trac.wxwidgets.org: 21.3 G

 Thanks for the numbers. Unfortunately that's way too much for even a
bonded 2 ADSL lines connection so it's useless even to try to move it here
(and while $99/month definitely seems rather expensive for hosting, paying
for a SDSL connection costs about 10 times as much).

 So it looks like we don't have any real choice except for GG (I don't see
any reason to prefer Yahoo Groups)...

 Regards,
VZ

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Re: Trac problems and hosting

Marcin Wojdyr-3
In reply to this post by Robin Dunn
On Tue, May 5, 2009 at 12:52, Robin Dunn <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Vadim Zeitlin wrote:
>>
>>  Hi,
>>
>> I don't offer to host it myself because I don't think I
>> have enough bandwidth (BTW, Robin, do you have any idea about how much
>> does
>> it consume?)
>
> Trac requires SVN is on the same machine, so if Trac is moved then SVN would
> need to be also.  The two reporting tools I have installed report different
> usage stats, but the largest reported numbers for April are:
>
> svn.wxwidgets.org:      25.5 G
> trac.wxwidgets.org:      9.9 G

How about using trac with a mirror of svn repo:
http://trac.edgewall.org/wiki/TracFaq#can-i-use-trac-with-a-remote-subversion-repository

Svn can be hosted on SF or google.


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Re: Trac problems and hosting

Bryan Petty
On Wed, May 6, 2009 at 1:37 PM, Marcin Wojdyr <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Svn can be hosted on SF or google.

Before this suggestion gets any farther, I'd just like to point out
that we moved all wx stuff off of SF for a good reason, and we can't
actually host the code on Google since the wxWindows Licence isn't a
Google-approved license.

Regards,
Bryan Petty
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Re: Trac problems and hosting

f18m_cpp217828 (Bugzilla)
In reply to this post by Marcin Wojdyr-3
Marcin Wojdyr ha scritto:
> On Mon, May 4, 2009 at 06:11, Vadim Zeitlin <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>  Hi,
>>
>>  Does anybody know if poor Trac performance and frequent errors are due to
>> the software itself or lack of resources on the server which hosts it? I.e.
>
> I remember reading somewhere that using postgresql instead of sqlite
> (we are using sqlite, right?) prevents "datebase is locked" errors.
Fixing the "database is locked" error would be fantastic.

I just had to rewrite (long!!) comments to two Trac tickets because of that
error (grrrr). It happens very very often IME; say 1 every 5 "submit" operations
I do with Trac. In fact, I usually do write my replies to trac tickets in a
separate editor and then copy&paste the text in the trac form and try to use it.
Unfortunately I didn't so the last time and I had to rewrite all the comments.

In fact I often give up because of those errors.

Moving from SF tracker to Trac was a great thing, but the current situation is
still far from ideal.

Has anyone experience with the performances of SF Trac hosting?

Btw before making any change, I'd strongly suggest to upgrade our installation
to the latest version of Trac (0.11.4), given 0.11.1 is almost one year old and
that lots of things got fixed in Trac in the meanwhile.

Francesco



PS: also upgrading buildbot would be a very nice thing; I really start to hate
that waterfall view now that there are so many buildslaves.

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Re: Trac problems and hosting

f18m_cpp217828 (Bugzilla)
In reply to this post by Marcin Wojdyr-3
Marcin Wojdyr ha scritto:

> On Tue, May 5, 2009 at 12:52, Robin Dunn <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Vadim Zeitlin wrote:
>>>  Hi,
>>>
>>> I don't offer to host it myself because I don't think I
>>> have enough bandwidth (BTW, Robin, do you have any idea about how much
>>> does
>>> it consume?)
>> Trac requires SVN is on the same machine, so if Trac is moved then SVN would
>> need to be also.  The two reporting tools I have installed report different
>> usage stats, but the largest reported numbers for April are:
>>
>> svn.wxwidgets.org:      25.5 G
>> trac.wxwidgets.org:      9.9 G
>
> How about using trac with a mirror of svn repo:
> http://trac.edgewall.org/wiki/TracFaq#can-i-use-trac-with-a-remote-subversion-repository
indeed decoupling the two services on two different machines would enhance both
performances and reliability...

> Svn can be hosted on SF or google.
Also note that SF now hosts Trac and many other services.

Playing a bit with http://apps.sourceforge.net/trac/sourceforge/wiki/WikiStart 
it looks like it's quite fast...

Francesco



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